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To character select | 〈 Kunimitsu / Law 〉
# | Command | Hit level | Damage | Start up frame | Block frame | Hit frame | Counter hit frame | Notes | |||||||
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
SPECIAL MOVES | SPECIAL MOVES | ||||||||||||||
#1 | Command | Hit level | Damage | Start up frame | Block frame | Hit frame | Counter hit frame | Notes | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | in rage 1+2 | m | 55 | 20 pc8~17 | -22 | KND | KND | Rage art | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | in rage SEN 1+2 | m (DEN) | 27 | 12~13 | +7~+8 | KND | KND | Rage art | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | in rage SEN 1+2, b+2+3 | m, ! | 27,33 | 12~13 | KND | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | in rage DEN 3+4 | l, m | 16,16 | 21 | -13 | launch | launch | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 1 | h | 7 | 10 | +1 | +8 | +8 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 1, 1 | h, m | 7,8 | 10 | -8~-7 | 0~+1 | 0~+1 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 1, 1, 1 | h, m, m | 7,8,20 | 10 | -14~-13 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 1, 2 | h, h | 7,9 | 10 | -1 | +7 | +7 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 1, 4 | h, l | 7,10 | 10 | -12~-11 | +1~+2 | +1~+2 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 2 | h | 10 | 10 | 0 | +8 | +8 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 2, 1 | h, m | 10,7 | 10 | -5~-4 | +6~+7 | +6~+7 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 2, 1, 3 | h, m, m | 10,10,20 | 10 | -12~-11 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 2, 1, 4 | h, m, h | 10,10,27 | 10 | -7~-6 | KND | KND | Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 3 | h | 16 | 15 | -12 | +5 | +5 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 3, D | h | 16 | 15s | -10 | +7 | +7 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 4 | h | 27 | 17~18 | -7~-6 | KND | KND | Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+1 | h | 10 | 13 | -5 | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+1, 2 | h, m | 10,11 | 13 | -5 | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+1, 2, F | h, m (SEN) | 10,11 | 13 | -8 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+1, 2, 3 | h, m, m | 10,11,20 | 13 | -9 | KND | JG | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+1, 2, 3, F | h, m, m, (DEN) | 10,11,20 | 13 | -12 | KND | JG | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+2 | h | 10 | 12 | -6 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+2, 1 | h, h, (SEN) | 10,15 | 12 | -5 | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+2, 1, F | h, h (SEN) | 10,15 | 12 | -6 | +5 | +5 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+2, 4 | h, h | 10,22 | 12 | -12~-11 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+4 | m | 12 | 17 | -9 | +7 | +7 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+4, 1 | m, m | 12,8 | 17 | -9~-8 | +2~+3 | +2~+3 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+4, 1, 2 | m, m, m | 12,8,8 | 17 | -10 | +2 | +2 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+4, 1, 2, 1 | m, m, m, m | 12,8,8,20 | 17 | -14~-13 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+1+2 | m | 20 | 15~16 | -13~-12 | CS | CS | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+1+4 | m | 28 | 13 | -18 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+1 | m | 14 | 13 | -1 | +5 | +5 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+2 | m | 15 | 16~17 | -8 | +3~-4a | +3~-4a | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+2, 1 | m, m | 15,20 | 16 | -14~-13 | Tail spin | Tail spin | Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+3 | m | 15 | 16 | -7 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+3, D | m, (DEN) | 15 | 16 | -4(-8) | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+3, 3 | m, m | 15,24 | 16a | -15~-14 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+4 | m | 16 | 15~16 | -8~-7 | +2~+3 | +2~+3 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/f+1+2 | m | 25 | 25 pc8~24 | -12 | KND | KND | Power crush | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d+2 | m | 17 | 18~19 | 0~+1s | +8~+9s | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d+2, D | m | 17 | 18~19 | 0~+1s | +8~+9s | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d+3 | l | 8 | 15 | -14 | -3 | -3 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d+3, 1 | l, hh | 8,4,10 | 15 | -7 | +4 | +4 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d+1+2 | l (TC) | 25 | 24~25s cs20~ | -20~-19 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+1 | l (TC) | 9 | 17s cs6~ | -12 | -1 | -1 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+1, 3 | l (TC), h | 9,10 | 17 6~ | -12 | -1 | -1 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+1, 3, D | l (TC), h | 9,10 | 17 6~s | -10 | +1 | +1 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+2 | m | 12 | 15 | -8 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+2, F | m, (SEN) | 12 | 15 | -5 | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+2, 1 | m, m | 12,8 | 15 | -8~-7 | +6~+7 | +6~+7 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+2, 3 | m, m | 12,15 | 15 | -13 | 0 | +23g(KND) | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+2, 3* (Very long hold) | m, m | 12,25 | 15 | +8 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+4 | l (TC) | 19 | 21~22s cs6~ | -26 | +5~+6s | JG | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | d/b+1+2 | m? | 18 | 26~27 | -14~-13 | +5~+6 | CS | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+1 | m | 17 | 15~17 | -9~-7 | +4~+6 | KND | Homing, Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+2 | m | 12 | 16 | -7 | +4 | +4 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+2, 1 | m, m | 12,17 | 16 | -10 | +4 | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+2, 3 | m, h | 12,21 | 16 | -8~-7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+3 | m | 14 | 17 | -12 | +4 | +4 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+3, F | m, (SEN) | 14 | 17 | -5 | +11 | +11 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+3, 4 | m, h | 14,20 | 17 | -8~-7 | KND | KND | Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+4 | m | 23 (,28) | 15 | -8 | +8 | Throw | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+4(CH in front) | m, (throw) | 27,23 | 15 | Throw(KND) | ||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+1+2 | mm | 8,20 | 21~22, 31~32 | -11~-10 | +6k | Tail spin | Homing, Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | b+2+3 | ! | 45 | 84~85 | KND | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | u/b or u or u/f+3 | m (TJ)(, m) | 12(,14) | 16~17s (,34) js12~ | -26~-25 (13~6a) | Launch | Launch | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | u/b+4 | m (TJ) | 20 | 25~27 js9~ | -9~-7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | u or u/f+4 | m (TJ) | 20 | 25~27 js9~ | -9~-7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, F+2 | m | 20 | 21~22 (22~) | -13~-12 | Launch | Launch | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, F+2 When hit f | m, (SEN) | 20 | 21~22 (22~) | Launch | Launch | |||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, F+3 | m | 22 | 18~19 (19~) | -8~-7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, F+4 | l | 14 | 21(22~) | -31 | +5 | +5 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, F+4, 3 | l, m | 14,20 | 21(22~) | -16 | +8k (+17k wc) | +8k (+17 wc | Wall crush | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, F+1+2 | m | 20 | 16~17 (17~) | -9~-8 | KND | Tail spin | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, F+3+4 | ll | 11,15 | 19~20 ,29~30 (20~) cs21~ | -16~-15 | 0~+1s | |||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, b+2 | m | 10 | 14(14~) | -12 | 0 | 0 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, b+2, 1 | m, m | 10,10 | 14(14~) | -18~-17 | BU | BU | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f, f, f+3 | m (TJ) | 30 | 20~26 (23~) js3~ | +8~+14g | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+1 | m | 16 | 15~16 | -12~-11 | Launch | Launch | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+1 When hit f | m, (SEN) | 16 | 15~16 | Launch | Launch | |||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+2 | m | 13 | 13~14 | -8~-7 | +3~+4 | +3~+4 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+2, F | m, (SEN) | 13 | 13~14 | -5~-4 | +7~+8 | +6~+7 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+2, D | m, (DEN) | 13 | 13~14 | -12~-11 | 0~+1 | -1~0 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+2, 1 | m, m | 13,17 | 13~14 | -12~-11s | +5~+6s | Launch | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+3 | h | 30 | 20 | +7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | WS+4 | m | 16 | 11~12 | -6~-5 | +5~+6 | +5~+6 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | FC+d/f+2 | m | 19 | 16 | -8 | +5 | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | FC+d/f+1+2 | ll | 10,14 | 18,31~32 cs1~ | -12~-11 | +1~+2 | +1~+2 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SS+2 | m | 20 | 16~17 (25~) | -7~-6 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | Opponent Down d+3+4 | l | 25 | 22~23 | -14~-13 | -3~-2 | -3~-2 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | Opponent Down d+3+4*, F | l (SEN) | 20 | 22~23 | -14~-13 | -3~-2 | -3~-2 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 1+2+3+4 | (Special) | 22~23 | ||||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | 1+2+3+4, 2 | m | 20 | 16~17 (46~) js14~ | -18~-17 | Launch (JG?) | Launch (JG?) | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SEN only from certain moves | (SEN) | 16~17 (46~) 14~ | ||||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SEN 1 | m | 27 | 12~13 | -10~-9 | KND | KND | Wall bounce | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SEN 2 | l | 20 | 19~20s cs12~ | -12~-11 | +5~+7s | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SEN 3 | m | 20 | 14~16 ar14~ | -14~-12 | Launch (JG?) | Launch (JG?) | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SEN 4 | h | 27 | 20~21 | -10~-9 | Launch (Screw) | Launch (Screw) | Power crush, Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SEN 3+4 | mm (TJ) | 6,22 | 13~14 js7~ | -6 | +11k | +11k | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | SEN d/f+1 | m | 20 | 14~15 | 0~+1s | +8~+9s | Launch | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | f+3 or From certain moves | (Special) | cs 4~10 | 14~15 | |||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN F | (SEN) | |||||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 1 | h | 14 | 11~12 (26~) | -1~0 | +8~+9 | +8~+9 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 1, F | h, (SEN) | 14 | 11~12 (26~) | -3~-2 | +6~+7 | +6~+7 | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 1, 2 | h, h | 14,20 | 11~12 (26~) | -6~-5 | KND | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 2 | m? | 19 | 17~19 (32~) | -7~-5 | +7~+9 | CS | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 3 | m | 25 | 27~30 (42~) | +6~+9 | KND | KND | Wall bounce | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 4, 3 | l, m | 14,20 | 21 | -16 | +3 | +3 | Same as f, F+4, 3 | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 1+2 | h | 20 | 12~13s (28~) | -10~-9 | KND | KND | Tail spin | |||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 2+3 | h(Throw) | 20,20 | 12(27~) | Throw(KND) | ||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 2+3 (Opponent in air) | Air throw | 23,8 | 12(27~) | Throw(KND) | ||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | DEN 3+4 | ||||||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | u/b or u or u/f+3+4 | (Special) (TJ) | lc,a | ||||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | u/b or u or u/f+3+4* | h(Throw) | 40(50) | 9(25) js1~ | Throw(KND) | ||||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | u/f+3+4, 1 | l | 20 | 23~24s (53~) js1~10 cs20~ | -13~-12 | +3~+4s | KND | ||||||||
SPECIAL MOVES | u/f+3+4, 4 | m | 20(,20) | 17~18 (37~) js1~ | -8~-7 | +8~+9s | Throw(KND) | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | BASIC MOVES | ||||||||||||||
#2 | Command | Hit level | Damage | Start up frame | Block frame | Hit frame | Counter hit frame | Notes | |||||||
BASIC MOVES | 1 | h | 7 | 10 | +1 | +8 | +8 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | 2 | h | 10 | 10 | 0 | +8 | +8 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | 3 | h | 16 | 15 | -12 | +5 | +5 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | 4 | h | 27 | 17~18 | -7~-6 | KND | KND | Tail spin | |||||||
BASIC MOVES | f+1 | h | 10 | 13 | -5 | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | f+2 | h | 10 | 12 | -6 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | f+3 (to DEN) | (DEN) | 12 | ||||||||||||
BASIC MOVES | f+4 | m | 12 | 17 | -9 | +7 | +7 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/f+1 | m | 14 | 13 | -1 | +5 | +5 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/f+2 | m? | 15 | 16 | -8 | +3a | +3a | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/f+3 | m | 15 | 16 | -7 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/f+4 | m | 16 | 15~16 | -8~-7 | +2~+3 | +2~+3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d+1 | Sm (TC) | 5 | 10s cs4~ | -5 | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d+2 | m | 17 | 18~19 | 0~+1s | +8~+9s | KND | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d+3 | l | 8 | 15 | -14 | -3 | -3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d+4 | l (TC) | 7 | 12s cs4~ | -13 | -2 | -2 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/b+1 | l (TC) | 9 | 17s cs6~ | -12 | -1 | -1 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/b+2 | m | 12 | 15 | -8 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/b+3 | l (TC) | 12 | 16s cs4~ | -17 | -3 | -3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | d/b+4 | l (TC) | 19 | 21~22s cs6~ | -26 | +5~+6s | JG | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | b+1 | m | 17 | 15~17 | -9~-7 | +4~+6 | KND | Homing, Tail spin | |||||||
BASIC MOVES | b+2 | m | 12 | 16 | -7 | +4 | +4 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | b+3 | m | 14 | 17 | -12 | +4 | +4 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | b+4 | m | 23 (,28) | 15 | -8 | +8 | Throw | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | u/b or u+1 | m (TJ) | 12 | 18 js9~ | -8 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | u/f+1 | h | 12 | 13 | -16 | -5 | -5 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | u/b or u or u/f+2 | h | 17 | 15~16 | -12~-11 | +9~+10g | +9~+10g | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | u/b or u or u/f+3 | m (TJ)(, m) | 12(,14) | 16~17s (,34) js12~ | -26~-25 (13~6a) | Launch | Launch | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | u/b+4 | m (TJ) | 20 | 25~27 js9~ | -9~-7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | u or u/f+4 | m (TJ) | 20 | 25~27 js9~ | -9~-7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | u/f, n+4 | m | 25 | 23(29,35) js9~33 | -11(-13) | Launch (JG?) | Launch (JG?) | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | WS+1 | m | 16 | 15~16 | -12~-11 | Launch | Launch | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | WS+2 | m | 10 | 13~14 | -9~-8 | +2~+3 | +2~+3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | WS+3 | h | 30 | 20 | +7 | KND | KND | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | WS+4 | m | 16 | 11~12 | -6~-5 | +5~+6 | +5~+6 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | FC+1 | Sm (TC) | 5 | 10s cs1~ | -5 | +6 | +6 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | FC+2 | Sm (TC) | 8 | 11s cs1~ | -4 | +7 | +7 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | FC+3 | l (TC) | 12 | 16s cs1~ | -17 | -3 | -3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | FC+4 | l (TC) | 10 | 12s cs1~ | -15 | -4 | -4 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | SS+1 | h | 7 | 10(11~) | +1 | +8 | +8 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | SS+2 | m | 20 | 16~17 (25~) | -7~-6 | KND | KND | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | SS+3 | h | 16 | 15(16~) | -12 | +5 | +5 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | SS+4 | h | 27 | 17~18 (18~) | -7~-6 | KND | KND | Tail spin | |||||||
BASIC MOVES | BT 1 or 2 | h | 15 | 8 | -8 | +3 | +3 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | BT 3 or 4 | h | 25 | 10 | -8 | KND | KND | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | BT d+1 or 2 | Sm | 10 | 10s cs1~ | -2 | +9 | +9 | ||||||||
BASIC MOVES | BT d+3 or 4 | l | 12 | 10s cs1~ | -11 | +3 | +3 |
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25 Responses
SEN 1 now wall bounces!
Thanks for you feedback, and sorry for my late reply. I have updated the source data, and it will be live in website after the next deploy.
“Mark lars sen 1 as wallbounce, thanks to crunkplug” :
https://github.com/pbruvoll/rbnTekkenFrameData/commit/7c2446f0fe99665da1438f311854cbc3a59b7dc3
Hey, just curious what ED means in f+1+4
This was left from the initial translation. Updated to KND now. Thx for letting us know.
I can’t comment on the Armor King page but Armor King’s movelist says his standing 2 and 2,1 are low attacks. I suspect there could be other errors in Armor King’s page.
Sorry what does CS mean as a notation ?
Crumple stun
Where’s the FC DF+2 and SEN 4
It’s there now, FC+d/f+1+2 and SEN 4
you forgot to change SE2’s frames, I believe its i19 now
Thanks. Fixed
Just a heads up for the mods of this site, if DE 4,3 is the same as f,F+4,3, you need to make it so that it properly shows that DE 4,3 is +0 on hit and only DE 4 is +5. This is very misleading for newer Lars players as it could potentially mean it’s +5 on hit if it’s done through Dynamic Entry.
I dont see DEN 4, 3. I know no one cares about Lars, but man…lol
I’ve udpated data to season 2, so it’s there now
B1+2 SHOULD BE +12-+15 ON HIT,THEN B1 SHOULD BE +8-+10 ON HIT AND CAUSE A SPIN STATE. I ALSO THINK BACK ONE HAS A LOT OF POTENTIAL TO REPLACE DF2. LARS NEED AT LEAST ONE GOOD MOVE THAT WOULD MAKE HIM SCARY ON THE NEUTRAL AND CONTAIN MOVEMENT. SO YAH B1 SHOULD CAUSE A CRUMPLE STUN ON COUNTER HIT SIMILAR TO DF2 IN PREVIOUS TEKKEN GAMES.
Lars RA is pc7
LARS IS NEVER AT AN ADVANTAGE ON HIS STANDING 3D AND DB1,4D TRANSITIONS. LARS REMAINS -12 AND IN MY OPINION THAT DOESNT MAKE SENSE. MOST STANCE TRANSITIONS MUST EASE BLOCK DISADVANTAGE. TAKE A LOOK AT JIN’S F4-ZEN STANCE. JIN GOES FROM -8 TO -1-0 ON BLOCK(IF ITS A BLOCKED SHALLOW HIT). I THINK ITS FAIR FOR LARS TO BE -1 – -3 ON BLOCK.
I guess it was changed to 8 at a later time
b1+2 is a tailspin move too, not just homing
Thanks
F123 really -9 that changes how you can use lars heaps at 13 frames
It’s -9 But forced transition so he can get launched for free to be honest. But his moves come out at -9…
Den 3 new move
F,b 2 1 has less recovery 13f?
Db+4 more frame. Advangtage I think 3 and f f 3, 4 is +1 or 0 now
Do you mean f, f+4, 3 ? Think it is 0
Lars FR update
2,1,4 now tailspins